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Things i learned at the Supernatural convention yesterday... - Matt Cohen (young John and Michael), and Rob Benedict (Chuck) screamed when they saw an Australian huntsman spider (they jumped on their

I had to post this here too. It's a tiny Sam and Dean. Helps that Cals hair looks like Sams at the moment. #DriverPicksTheMusic #ShotgunShutsHisCakehole Sadly not an Impala. It's an old Ford

I'm slowly catching up. I made the biggest mistake possible, introducing my mum to SPN. She's a Wincest shipper after 4 episodes. Meanwhile I am leaning more towards Samifer and Dean/Alastair.  M

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It was terrible. Bad writing. Cliched plots. It's like they searched stories on Wattpad, FanFiction.Net and trawled comments on Reddit/Tumblr for ideas and decided to mesh them all together to create this travesty.

Dean's death was pathetic. He's a trained bloody hunter and was perfectly capable of fighting vampires (and worse monsters) pre season 4.

Sam living to become old is somewhat understandable. He's shown throughout the show he's happy to move on with life without Dean (season 8 cough cough). Still I thought it was terribly cliche and badly done. We don't even know who his wife is. She doesn't even get a mention.

Jack is God. He could've saved Dean. Why did he not do anything? What the fuck? At least Cas returned to heaven to help Jack run things, but this is just bad writing. I know he stated he was going to be a 'hands off' sort of God, but I thought he'd give a shit about Team Free Will. Apparently not.

Sigh.

Since when did the Winchesters become so weak and dumb? In Seasons 1-3 Sam and Dean could practically take on anything.

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Andddd the Supernatural drama is not going to end any time soon. 

Apparently fans found out that the confession from 15x18 was censored (with the censors not grabbing the reciprocation for the Latin America dub) and now #TheySilencedYou is trending lol

 

... CW are going to be in some serious shit if this keeps up. 

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13 hours ago, Nocturna said:

Andddd the Supernatural drama is not going to end any time soon. 

Apparently fans found out that the confession from 15x18 was censored (with the censors not grabbing the reciprocation for the Latin America dub) and now #TheySilencedYou is trending lol

 

... CW are going to be in some serious shit if this keeps up. 

What do you mean by censored? 

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Misha Collins wrote this on his social media:

I’m seeing a lot of commentary on the ending of SPN & the recent Spanish dub, and disheartened to see there are a lot of misconceptions that are making many in our family feel unheard & unsupported, so I’m calling a #SPNFamilyMeeting to sort a few things out for the record:
 
There was no conspiracy within the network, staff, or cast of SPN to minimize or erase representation from the narrative & there was no alternate ending to 1518. Dean was always too stunned in the moment to reply. (Apparently a rogue translator penned their own dialogue.)
 
Also, in my opinion Cas doesn't play into the "bury your gays" trope. His declaration of love saves Dean, enabling Sam and Dean to save all of humanity. And Cas doesn’t die! He actually goes on to rebuild Heaven!
 
Was the show perfect? No. Could Cas’ departure have had more resonance in the final episodes? Sure. But I’m confident you guys can sort that part out as your writing and art and imaginations play the story out past the last frames we filmed.
 
I’m proud to have spent more than a decade of my life telling a story where good consistently triumphs over evil...
 
And I’m especially proud that my character’s parting message was, “expressing your true self, letting yourself love who you truly want to love, openly & honestly, can literally save the world… & in the end, good things do happen — & they’re worth fighting for.” I love you all.
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I went back and watched the last episode. But nothing from the season they introduced Chuck as "God"

Honestly and this has gotten me backlash and probably more  but  I stopped watching it because it made me uncomfortable.  I wasn't happy with the Michael / Lucifer story line. But I pushed through it telling myself that it was only TV and fiction. I am not going so far as to say it was a crisis of faith.  But ... when I found myself yelling at the tv at how portrayed biblical characters than actually watching the show. I realized watching it didn't make me happy anymore. 

I loved... and still love the character development of the family dynamic. Dean by far was my favorite character . To watch him grow from the man he was in season one to when I stopped watching was a writers dream. And for the episodes that featured "the monster of the week" I appreciated as a viewer and writer.   My respect for the writers to keep the program on that long and the actors for their amazing ability to bring the show to life is awesome.     I was able to believe in the 'brothers' and not just be characters I visited once a week.

But the in the beginning of the Angels/Demons /God /Darkness it almost left me feeling like there was a war with religion on the show.  And I know many don't feel that way and its okay.  But for me to feel this way it took the fun out of it.

And while this is an unpopular (and will get me some hate)  I watch TV to be entertained. SPN stopped entertaining.  As for how it ended ... well I can say the acting was superior and it tied up how the brothers would go out.  And it was very believable especially knowing that some of it happened while trying to deal with Covid.

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14 hours ago, RykerDavis said:

I went back and watched the last episode. But nothing from the season they introduced Chuck as "God"

Honestly and this has gotten me backlash and probably more  but  I stopped watching it because it made me uncomfortable.  I wasn't happy with the Michael / Lucifer story line. But I pushed through it telling myself that it was only TV and fiction. I am not going so far as to say it was a crisis of faith.  But ... when I found myself yelling at the tv at how portrayed biblical characters than actually watching the show. I realized watching it didn't make me happy anymore. 

I loved... and still love the character development of the family dynamic. Dean by far was my favorite character . To watch him grow from the man he was in season one to when I stopped watching was a writers dream. And for the episodes that featured "the monster of the week" I appreciated as a viewer and writer.   My respect for the writers to keep the program on that long and the actors for their amazing ability to bring the show to life is awesome.     I was able to believe in the 'brothers' and not just be characters I visited once a week.

But the in the beginning of the Angels/Demons /God /Darkness it almost left me feeling like there was a war with religion on the show.  And I know many don't feel that way and its okay.  But for me to feel this way it took the fun out of it.

And while this is an unpopular (and will get me some hate)  I watch TV to be entertained. SPN stopped entertaining.  As for how it ended ... well I can say the acting was superior and it tied up how the brothers would go out.  And it was very believable especially knowing that some of it happened while trying to deal with Covid.

Yeah, agreed with your points (though our reasons may differ). I hate how soft and wimpy they made Lucifer - he became some comical character. As for Michael - they just butchered him bad. 

The actors totally carried the show, but it was the genius of Eric Kripke that made me love SPN. When he left, the show died (for me). As far as I'm concerned, SPN ended with season 5.

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13 hours ago, AquilaTempestas said:

I hate how soft and wimpy they made Lucifer - he became some comical character. As for Michael - they just butchered him bad. 

All I wanted out of Season 15 was a real resolution to the Lucifer/Michael plot line. Like the development was so small but meaningful in Season 5. Michael clearly stating he still cares for Lucifer, but feeling he has no choice but to obey their father. Lucifer begging him to walk away in Swan Song. I will always be salty that there was no real conclusion to this mess, just Lucifer serving God for, ahem, God knows what reason although he's spent so many seasons doing his own shit. And Michael having none of that bloody hesitation and struggle with familial love that he did in the Season 5 finale. Just some non-verbal sign like when he looked away like he was seriously considering listening to Lucifer and 'walking off the chess board', that would have been enough.

No I don't think I'll ever get over that complete failure of a subplot.

 

**** which is why in my own fictional works they'll both go through torture but have some form of closure even if they can't ultimately say 'fuck you' to destiny lul take that SPN writers ****

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On 1/10/2021 at 8:03 AM, Nocturna said:

All I wanted out of Season 15 was a real resolution to the Lucifer/Michael plot line. Like the development was so small but meaningful in Season 5. Michael clearly stating he still cares for Lucifer, but feeling he has no choice but to obey their father. Lucifer begging him to walk away in Swan Song. I will always be salty that there was no real conclusion to this mess, just Lucifer serving God for, ahem, God knows what reason although he's spent so many seasons doing his own shit. And Michael having none of that bloody hesitation and struggle with familial love that he did in the Season 5 finale. Just some non-verbal sign like when he looked away like he was seriously considering listening to Lucifer and 'walking off the chess board', that would have been enough.

No I don't think I'll ever get over that complete failure of a subplot.

 

**** which is why in my own fictional works they'll both go through torture but have some form of closure even if they can't ultimately say 'fuck you' to destiny lul take that SPN writers ****

I feel your pain. They had something in 05 and decided to throw everything away in later seasons because the SPN writers have no idea how to develop characters. 

I was doing some more research about Mark Sheppard and apparently he feels the same way. The SPN writers killed him off because they didn't know what to do with his character. Mark gave them ideas, but the writers ignored him, so he basically walked. The writers that took over after 011 were terrible. It's like reading bad fanfiction. They did Mark and his Crowley dirty, and they did the same to other characters too.

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  • 4 weeks later...
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This gets me dead. There's a better video with this song but this is the non-Sabriel version so the more friendly one to share, probably :P If anyone wants to see the other version, they just need to search 'Sam moose song'  and click on the obviously gay one. 

Just a warning- The song is definitely not something to be listened to around children or your grandparents. 

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  • 1 month later...
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I'm considering doing a character study, I did one for Gabriel as part of my Creative Writing coursework but I just rewatched Hammer Of the Gods and realised how that one episode is perhaps more representative of Lucifer than anything after Season 11.  Lucifer just kinda turns into a caricature of his prime Season 5 self, as I'm sure @AquilaTempestasagrees. 

Lets see, in Hammer of the Gods...

Spoiler

Lucifer invades the hotel and goes on a slaughter of the gods before killing Gabriel.

Lucifer is creepy calm about the aforementioned God slaughter and it shows his temper and cruelty in a more terrifying light than how he seems to be comic relief in Season 12+. He has always been a little childish, paraphrasing Gabriel he sees humanity as 'God's new toy' and out of jealousy is going around breaking them. But the sympathetic elements of his character are mostly forgotten about in S12+ in exchange for amplifying this whiny childishness. 

Lucifer also sheds tears when he kills poor Gabriel, and whilst the act is cruel his hand was kinda forced as Gabriel was about to shank him in the back. The scene prior is them trying to reason with each other, and Lucifer never really attempts anything like that in the later seasons. I need to rewatch the Gabriel and Lucifer conversation in S13 but I think a bit of that scene was rehashed from this one?

 I remember reading a tweet that theorised that the reason for Lucifer's sudden character change in S11+ was because they based his portrayal of Hallucifer, Sam's exaggerated hallucinations of Lucifer, rather than his Season 5 self. 

I'll consider making the character study thread so we can compare S5 Lucifer to S11+ Lucifer, but I'm going to need to rewatch some key scenes first maybe? I'm currently in the middle of watching all the Gabriel episodes and might go to all the Lucifer episodes later though there's a lot more so that'll take longer. 

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On 4/7/2021 at 10:08 PM, Nocturna said:

 

I'm considering doing a character study, I did one for Gabriel as part of my Creative Writing coursework but I just rewatched Hammer Of the Gods and realised how that one episode is perhaps more representative of Lucifer than anything after Season 11.  Lucifer just kinda turns into a caricature of his prime Season 5 self, as I'm sure @AquilaTempestasagrees. 

Lets see, in Hammer of the Gods...

  Reveal hidden contents

 I remember reading a tweet that theorised that the reason for Lucifer's sudden character change in S11+ was because they based his portrayal of Hallucifer, Sam's exaggerated hallucinations of Lucifer, rather than his Season 5 self. 

I'll consider making the character study thread so we can compare S5 Lucifer to S11+ Lucifer, but I'm going to need to rewatch some key scenes first maybe? I'm currently in the middle of watching all the Gabriel episodes and might go to all the Lucifer episodes later though there's a lot more so that'll take longer. 

Yeah, season 5 Lucifer in that episode in particular, showed there could be some path of redemption for Lucifer.

Personally, I think they just went with Hallucifer because they knew some people thought Mark P was great being a comic character and it was funny. It was fine the first few times, but then they totally ruined his character for no reason. Mark P plays a great villain. Lucifer didn't need to be reduced to some parody.

The other theory was that the writers just can't do shit and don't know how to make deep meaningful character development arcs hence why Crowley's actor wanted off the show (also some pay dispute rumours, but the main reason was he just didn't like how they handled Crowley's arc)

 

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13 minutes ago, AquilaTempestas said:

Yeah, season 5 Lucifer in that episode in particular, showed there could be some path of redemption for Lucifer.

Personally, I think they just went with Hallucifer because they knew some people thought Mark P was great being a comic character and it was funny. It was fine the first few times, but then they totally ruined his character for no reason. Mark P plays a great villain. Lucifer didn't need to be reduced to some parody.

The other theory was that the writers just can't do shit and don't know how to make deep meaningful character development arcs hence why Crowley's actor wanted off the show (also some pay dispute rumours, but the main reason was he just didn't like how they handled Crowley's arc)

 

Yeah what I think they should have done if they wanted Lucifer around again is have him back from Season 11, mention him fucking Jack's mum offscreen or something, then either kill him or chuck him back in the cage. Then his character would have left the show with some dignity. 

Or they could have used Jack to give him proper redemption, as I thought they were going to do when Baby Satan was introduced. I thought the whole thing with Jack would have been Lucifer going 'ha I can parent better than you' then genuinely caring for him and openly trying to do better.  Anything to do with family could have been the catalyst for him to reform, even if it started out of pettiness. 

Or they could have left Lucifer dead in S14 and not bring him back to be Daddy's bitch. It's like they couldn't resist fucking up Lucifer's character one last time and decided to do a double-whammy with Michael's too. 

 

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